Odd Metal jars

[PyroJoe]

From what I can tell the flame cone is surrounded by exhaust gas of the previous combustion. There needs to be room enough for the developing flame cone and a fair amount of left over exhaust.

The cone will grow and squeeze the exhaust gas upwards torwards the opening. The process is accelerated by a gradual convergence towards the opening, but is not necessary to run. When hammering the four fin and the smashed flat, I was thinking the top half only needs 50% volume as compared to the bottom. I got lucky and those two run well.

"They found even as the hot gases were being ejected out the tailpipe, towards the end of the cycle, that flow was being choked down and inflow was occurring at the same time the hot "center gases" were still charging outbound"

I think this is also spot on description.

Still not sure why Reynst used that inner ring. I figure it had multiple functions. Exhaust choke (I hope), mixing device and/or a mechanical seperation between intake and exhaust gas. It can also be a space saver, allowing rather short chambers to run where the short geometry would prove fussy without it.

I attempted to build one today that would run at normal freq on it's side. Had my posterior handed to me on that one. Learned a great deal today. My failure today may shed some light on how to achieve side running.

I have to find a way to suspend the fuel when the bottom is tipped up and becomes a side wall. I carefully video'd a glass jar and found the flame cone will touch 80 to 90%? of the flame pool surface to free enough vapor to run. When the jar is on it's side and the pool flows to horizontal the cone is only contacting about 10 to 20% of the pool. A jar can run this way but is very slow and fussy.

[Mark]

Maybe a sideways jam jar would benefit from some anti-slosh plates or a little bit of asymmetric design; not being identical on both sides of the center line might help. The vortex is going to encounter/sense friction on the "bottom side" as it flows over the pool of fuel. And since the erratic whirling vortex is normally a bottom feeder and not a sidewinder slinger you could either figure a way to set up a feed at the bottom/far end or fuel it from somewhere near the intake, aspirating fuel in a low pressure zone, although potentially wasteful with the methanol if that is what you will use. I was dwelling on what qualifies as a low pressure zone, if it could be a region where over half the phase is lower than the high pressure is high? In that Russian book, there is a little one-way reed valve for bleeding off pressure to a fuel tank. Maybe that could be incorporated into the mix. If you punch a small hole in the side of a pulsejet and use this little one-way valve, you can pull a vacuum or bleed off a head of pressure just by flipping the reed to do the opposite. As a pulsejet has a high and low pressure phase, the little one-way reed can catch that phase. I think in the illustration in the book, the pressure phase would raise the manometer level a little bit more than vacuum phase could lower it but both could be usefully employed if needed.
Once I thought about a single hollow rod straight down the midde of typical jam jar, the vorticity tolerating this little intrusion and feeding it through this straw if it could learn how to suckle. Another offshoot of a thin hollow rod down the center is that it could also be threaded and thus serve to affix your lid to your vessel with a little T at the top that spokes out, again careful to have a small signature so as not to interfere with the typical hole in the center jam jar motif/theme.
I recall I had a paper on a crude pulsejet where the fellow used 4 all-thread rods outside the length of the combustion chamber to hold the aerosol can and valve plate to the fence pipe exhaust tube.
Well anyway, you could get a die and some 16th inch diameter copper tubing even for a prototype and thread the top and bottom ends so as to have some threads to tie it from the bottom of your vessel to the top. Or anything better that you might imagine, some variation of the theme.
I better stop here, I'm scattering ideas with no direction, turning in half done homework as usual.

[Mark]

This is just a collapsible cup with a little cone of metal I taped to the top. It runs very well, quite impressive in fact. Now it is narrow at the bottom and then it's at it's widest 3/4 the way up, and then the cone cap tapers/narrows to the apex. I don't know what's going on here, I don't know what anyone could infer from it or if it worth knowing. ha
Maybe the taper is so slight it doesn't figure into anything.

[PyroJoe]

Here is the design fabricated yesterday. It has several issues. The flame cone doesn't have a perpindicular surface to contact. The neck is also a little narrow for my taste.

It reminds me of a fish found in the depths of the sea. Angler fish maybe. ha

A drill bit was placed in the opening to give a reference angle of the opening. I attempted to use that intake angle to splash alcohol onto the front surface to generate more vapor.

That collapsible cup opens up some operating range. Does it run normal or at a slower frequency than a comparable wide bottom jar?

The glass jar in the pic is also a good runner.

[Mark]

The collapsible cup is just zippy fast and steady running. What's surprising is that the blue vinyl tape holds up to fairly long 10 second runs without being affected. And the thing is hot when it is done running.
Your glass jar kind of looks like a maraschino cherry jar; I have tried an incredible amount of jars too, I usually like the smaller ones best because they rev faster and often times have more of an instant/startling start effect.
Your angler fish is a noble try. One day we will master the art/Zen of horizontal jam jarring. What have we learned today grasshoppers? What an endearing phrase. ha

[Mark]

Here is a swell running jar too, it runs a longer amount of time, I think partly because it is a heat sinc, the weighted base absorbs a lot of heat. It's made not to tip over easily. I don't know what's in the base but it is one solid feeling jam jar.

Here's a taller one which comes with a tuning fork and a reflex hammer for those knee jerk ideas.
http://tinyurl.com/23jfr7

[Mark]

Here's my taller one too, but it rolled when I was scanning it and I just didn't care, can you tell? I thought it might make for a stylized scan.

[Mark]

Here's a few aluminum bottles I haven't tried but might be good for some little idea. Yawn.

[Mark]

I was thinking for a sideways jar something like this might do. Looks like you could pump in some propane or maybe even methanol down the center tube and "bubble it" out those three spokes in the bottom. But the two other holes look a little restrictive, if you get my drift. Still, the quartz jar might be capable of being altered or by some chance the two side "exhaust" ports may just be large enough. I mean it teases me, this jar has been listed for quite some time. You wouldn't have to worry about it cracking from the heat probably, (if indeed it is made of pure quartz). Nor would you have to worry about melting it, I've blowtorched some quartz tubing and it didn't phase it even though glowing red hot, like those electric quartz heaters you see that fire up rather quickly.
http://tinyurl.com/33voxc
http://youtube.com/watch?v=ju_h-ml5cOo

[PyroJoe]

Fabricated a new top for the M.T.S. platform today. Preparing to fabricate inserts for side running.

Propane is probably the easiest way to feed on the side. That bridge still awaits. Tufty wisely advised that direction in a previous thread also. The stubborn will wear off and that path will be tread someday.

[Mark]

I was just out in my garage and happened to notice I had a maraschino cherry jar just sitting there so I fired it up. It reved up very fast for a few seconds like it was perfect then slowed to a slower speed and I stopped it. I can only suppose that since is was running so well and stable and then to go slow so quickly after say 3 or 4 seconds that it must have become too rich.
I found another tapered jar but I it is too long at 17 inches, maybe though you could cut it to size if you were desperate to make something of it. ha
Another old thing I tried tonight was a smudge pot/sidewalk oil lamp from Lowe's. It's a funny, somewhat energetic base sounding pop, pop, pop, etc. It runs irregularly, but amusing for the 6 or so seconds before losing the beat. The little hole is for a cotter pin to hold the cap by a chain when you choose to extinguish the wick. I guess it qualifies as a two-holed jam jar. ha

[Mark]

A few torchy items if you scroll down that could be used for simple experiments.
http://www.gidesigns.net/copper-torches.html
http://www.kitchensource.com/pau/images/bm-65014.jpg

This one is has a pulsejet potential to it. (lower left)
http://www.greekfoodandwine.com/cookware.htm

You can blow the picture up to a larger size, I kind of like it, a floating jam jar. ha
http://www.thegreenhead.com/2007/07/blo ... h-ball.php

Yawn.
http://www.kitchenfantasy.com/images/028901000660.jpg
http://www.germes-online.com/direct/dbi ... il_Pot.jpg

[Mark]

Hollow shapes that could be some kind of something maybe.
http://www.rus-sell.com/image_id20304w0 ... _steel.jpg
http://tinyurl.com/2trb6u

[PyroJoe]

I'm glad you reported on the cherry jar. I had observed the same thing with the one I run. Starts rough, then smooths out. A real smooth runner is the picante jar like the one I posted previously. It will smooth out to the sweetest of pulses. Almost like music. That is what tempted me to run it till it cracked. ha

[Mark]

I remember one time I was jam jarring in the garage and I lit the jar again but it needed to be refreshed more. So I have this grinder next to me and I turn it on, there is a wire wheel on one side of the grinder, a stone wheel on the other. The wire wheel throws a bit of air so I had taken to clicking the switch on and airing out my devices that way, to cool them down too.
So with this jar I took the cap off, not realizing there was that little dome of fire still alive on the lid. When I took the lid off the vapors in the jar lit and I had a fire jar. So I quickly held the mouth of the jar in the breeze of the spinning wire wheel, which only fanned the flames wildly. Quickly thinking, I tried to extinguish/smother/suffocate the flaming jar by quickly twisting a Smucker's half twist and the tight lid is back on, like catching a bee in a jar. Well suddenly, the now very warm jar decided to rev up and took off running full grease, not what I wanted because the jar was already getting too hot! I had to hustle and cap the lid with something to stop it. What a riot of unexpectedness.
I was thinking if you had a can with a open end and a hole in the bottom, you could have a little dish of alcohol burning and quickly/hypothetically slap a primed/misted can over the burning dish and start up a jam jar that way, like trapping a fast little bug on the floor. If you had a smooth surface, like a neoprene or silicone mat, the can will seal well enough I should think, when the can is pressed down onto it. Of course you couldn't run it for a long time, but it would be a funny way to start a jar.
Or you could use a grinder with a wire wheel. ha