Different oxidizers?

[Zippiot]

:) thanx for the help, I will order the books this second!

I have been making the estes rockets since I was 4, got all the way up to a d class motor until my city outlawed model rocket launches. It was just recently re-legalized (I can make up words too) and now that I have some chem and machining experience I wanted to make my own motors.

I have successfully made 1 time use motors around the c class. But they did not have ejection charges.

I have made crimson powder and thee is a fatal flaw, it cannot be strained by ordinary means!! Seriously try it, I used coffe filters [failed] fish filters [failed, didnt strain enough] and everyhting except the screen door, and since the fish filter failed a screen wotn work...


I lost my nozzle so I must make a new one, the last was a convergent divergent with a 40 degree convergence and a 11 degree divergence, sound good for an e or f class?

[Ray]

I lost my nozzle so I must make a new one, the last was a convergent divergent with a 40 degree convergence and a 11 degree divergence, sound good for an e or f class?

Why don't you study the books and tell me if the nozzle is good for that class motor?

Just a few questions that you should answer...
What KN value do you want?
What expansion ratio are you looking for?

There are some general rules that apply to nozzles, the books will cover them very well.

[Ray]

Sorry for the double post...but I thought of something after I posted the last.

You'll find that people are a lot more helpful about sharing knowledge with you if you ask intelligent questions...ones that demostrate that you have the basic background to support the answers.

Non-intellegent question;
How do I make a rocket motor?

Intelligent question;
I've noticed that the amount a combustion calalyst effects the burn rate is not linear, is there a way to calculate the effect of a specific combustion catalyst and make the burn rate changes more predictable?

In the first question, no knowledge of the subject matter is demonstrated, and the answer will likely be an emphatic NO!

The second shows that you have done some experimentation, you understand the nature of a combustion catalyst and that your results were not what you expected. You have come to someone more knowledgable and experienced than you to try to understand one specific portion of the whole. You are more likely to gain the knowlege you seek and a meaningful dialog can take place.

I hope you see that the questions you have posed in the past are of the kind that show that you haven't studied what you are doing...and the answers you receive are reflective of that, mostly warnings to NOT proceed. I am sure that if you change the way you ask the questions to reflect that you have at least studied the material, your answers will be much more meaningful.

Remember that knowledge should ALWAYS preceed experimentation. When you perform an experiment, you should have a good concept of what the results will be. If the results don't match the predictions, then you go back, study the results and try to understand what was wrong about your experiment, or your knowledge, correct for the error, and experiment again.

Energetic chemistry is dangerous, people, even those with extensive knowledge of it, have been killed doing this. Please approach this with knowledge and caution before proceeding.

[Dang911]

Just to add the list, I forgot to mention Sulfates and Chlorates. DO NOT MIX THEM. I know you got a C in chem, but do you remember what the most reactive element was? It is fluorine if you don't remember. What's next to fluorine, chlorine. Chlorine is nasty, not only will it kill you as a poison, it will, WILL, react with a ton of other elements. Compounds containing chlorates, are usually reactive to some nature.....

Why is potassium chlorate more dangerous than potassium perchlorate? If you can answer this question, than you might earn some respect back around here.

[bob000555]

dude if u relly cant balence reactions (i use it cuz im to lazzy) use http://theodoregray.com/PeriodicTable/M ... eReactions

[bob000555]

grrr i cant find Chemistry of Powder and Explosives at any libary even the library of congress dosnt have it...

[bob000555]

watch this movie about how dangors alminum powder is...its cool and a cool site http://www.cci.ethz.ch/mainmov.html?exp ... language=1

[Zippiot]

The local water bottleing plant had a chlorine leak a few years ago, had to evacuate a 7 mile radius!!
I have been doing my homework since the end of the first page of this thread, I have become more efficient in balancing equations. electron configurations (the new method not the borh) and electron dot configs. I am aware of the dangers of sulfates, but when not mixed with chlorates it takes extreme temps to start a reaction correct? My buddy demostrated calcium sulfate and magnesium sulfate (plaster of paris and epsom salts respectively) being useless in a kno3/sugar motor, then he added them to his Special Mix [no idea what is in it] and there was an explosion about 1/2 way through combustion...Fiberglass motor tubes, pretty thick.

Reading from the internet as I await 3 more books to arrive:
All chlorates and perchlorates are toxic, and perchlorates release strong acid during combustion. Do not touch!
Chlorates are friction and shock sensitive.
Nitrates are soluable in water, but ammonium nitrate cannot be recrystalized like potassium nitrate.
Barium nitrate requires a dot permit to ship (?)
Ammonium nitrate will explode by itself under special circumastnaces


I am interested in composite propellants as I have had 2 catos from KNSU cracking during prep. I read about Silicone based propellants working nicely, as they do not need to be heated at 140 degrees for 4 days. But the only successfuly formula I can find is ammonium nitrate based, I will stay away until I know morw about it.
The last cato blew apart my kevlar body tube, I was using fiberglass reinfoced t6 aluminum 2mm thick motor casings. That set me back a lot of cash and time, a propellant less likely to cato is what I am looking for. Any ideas?

[Ray]

a propellant less likely to cato is what I am looking for. Any ideas?

Yep, read the book. There are some good starter formulas in there.

[Zippiot]

So I emailed the person about getting the book you suggested, and I grabbed a few others off of amazon.com. Havent heard from the site you recomended yet, maybe it wasn't ordinary buiseness hours.

[Zippiot]

Are any of these books any good?
http://webpages.charter.net/rocketscien ... solid.html

That is just the propellant catagory, there are many other books on that site also.
Just thought I should order a few of each type to get the best background.

[Zippiot]

Book arrived this afternoon, I am already on page 70 (and I promise I read the safety stuff) and it is quite well written, thanx for the recomendation.

But now that I have all this info on composites I might have to retire my near finished G class KNSU project. Might be able to salvage the carbon fiber rocket and just repalce the engine mounts (and the motor itself...).