PDE engine video

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Beaker
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PDE engine video

Post by Beaker » Mon Jul 11, 2005 10:41 am

Wow this PDE site is great, not sure if this link has been posted before. If it has sorry for the repost.
I would love to build one of these.

http://www.innssi.com/pde.aspx

skyfrog
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re: PDE engine video

Post by skyfrog » Mon Jul 11, 2005 11:45 am

My last visit that site was about an year ago, and it seems nothing new were posted ever since. A wild guess either technological barrier in the development of PDE couldn't be break through or funds from the US government were cut.

I recall a member of this forum have some keen comments on PDE development, but can't remember who :-)
Long live jet engine !
Horace
Jetbeetle

Mark
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re: PDE engine video

Post by Mark » Mon Jul 11, 2005 2:47 pm

This one from that site reminds me of conjuring the genie from the bottle, sort of looks like a chest and arms, the one on the right.
http://www.innssi.com/rms01.htm
And this one looks like bioluminescent fluid jellyfish to me.
http://www.innssi.com/hpiv01.htm
http://faculty.washington.edu/cemills/Hydromedusae.html
I wonder if there has ever been an art exhibit featuring eddy currents and the like? Seems like there would be some artist inspired by them. Of course Starry Night comes to mind.
http://www.innssi.com/piv05.htm
http://www.andreaplanet.com/mosaic/starrynight/
Mark
Here's a tangent in searching for green jellyfish/"eddyfish."
http://www.forbes.com/2001/07/26/0726gfp_print.html
http://www.rcsb.org/pdb/molecules/pdb42_1.html
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Mark
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re: PDE engine video

Post by Mark » Mon Jul 11, 2005 3:40 pm

For all you valved pulsejet lovers, are there any left?, I noticed this engine also could use the "pulsations" or as they say, (mechanical power), to actuate/drive the valves.
If they break/shatter windows with the noise, you would really need to live in the desert or some remote place to test them. I just wonder how loud they are?
Mark
http://www.innssi.com/pde12.htm
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Mark
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re: PDE engine video

Post by Mark » Mon Jul 11, 2005 3:48 pm

When this engine starts to run, what are the flecks of light further up the exhaust tubes, is hot exhaust escaping from tiny ports or is it just distortion from the camera do you think?
Mark
http://www.innssi.com/pde12.htm
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Mark
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re: PDE engine video

Post by Mark » Mon Jul 11, 2005 4:24 pm

I was thinking from a marketing perspective, if you could design a lantern that formed a constant flame, vague eddy image of a genie or jinn, it might sell. And stretching it a bit, I wonder if some such flame swirl inspired the Aladdin lamp story, "Arabian Nights' Entertainments."
Mark
Once again http://www.innssi.com/rms01.htm
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dynajetjerry
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re: PDE engine video

Post by dynajetjerry » Mon Jul 11, 2005 4:30 pm

Mark,

The lab. where "my" 10P14 was operated is the one shown in these PDE demonstrations, Building 18, Area B, WPAFB.

Because PDE fuel and air are pre-mixed in stoichiometric proportions as they are injected into the combustion chambers, pressures (and sound levels,) are very high, similar to large firecrackers exploding 80 times each second. As with firecrackers, the combustion is extremely rapid, making for very sharp and short duration shock waves. When Mike Melvill sat in Rutan's Long-Eze during one series of demonstrations, he was obliged to wear sound-blocking head gear. Vibrations are also significant but was not discussed at the time I was present.

The specks of light that can be seen in the exhaust are, probably, contamination in the air or particles from the combustion chambers that break off during operation. They do not appear to be of any importance.

Jerry

Mark
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re: PDE engine video

Post by Mark » Mon Jul 11, 2005 4:48 pm

Jerry,
I was just clicking on the site randomly without thinking and couldn't help but notice one engine running seemed to look like a pulsejet plume. Then I read it was a pulsejet! Your Solar I realize now.
The flecks of light I was referring to on the detonation engine are way up from the exhaust end, nearer to where the exhaust tubes connect to the main portion of the engine complex.
Mark
Last edited by Mark on Mon Jul 11, 2005 9:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Bruno Ogorelec
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re: PDE engine video

Post by Bruno Ogorelec » Mon Jul 11, 2005 4:52 pm

What never fails to impress me is the incredible amount of machinery needed to make those small tubes work. I know that the performance justifies it, but it still looks weird.

hagent
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Re: re: PDE engine video

Post by hagent » Mon Jul 11, 2005 8:12 pm

Bruno Ogorelec wrote:What never fails to impress me is the incredible amount of machinery needed to make those small tubes work. I know that the performance justifies it, but it still looks weird.
It's hard to believe it could get off the ground, because of the weight, at least it looks heavy... Maybe it would make a good boat? :)

Or they could take another swing at Temple 1 !
Hagen Tannberg

Mark
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re: PDE engine video

Post by Mark » Mon Jul 11, 2005 9:29 pm

I wonder how hard it would be to adapt a lawn mower sized twin engine to make a single duct PDE, if you could remove the spark plug, thread in a pipe and valve it so that when the piston with fuel and air reached top dead center you could valve it into a length of pipe and "detonate" it.
Mark
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pezman
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re: PDE engine video

Post by pezman » Mon Jul 11, 2005 11:03 pm

Hey lawn mower guy, quit reading my mind! As an aside, I think that you'd only need 1 cylinder per tube. At the very least, you'd end up with a high-compression pulse-jet with a very long valve-life.

After reading their most recent paper, I was surprised that propane had such a high octane and that white gas might be a good detonable fuel. I was also surprised how many fuels they managed to detonate as a fuel/air mixture.

Mark
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re: PDE engine video

Post by Mark » Tue Jul 12, 2005 12:28 am

I think it would be funny to see a lawnmower with a piece of thick 1/2 inch plumbing pipe or so sticking out of it, and of course the really funny part could be when you pull the cord to start it.
Then you could push it around pulse-detonating weeds and such. If neighbors complain you could just say your new muffler idea isn't working out so well.
Mark
Last edited by Mark on Tue Jul 12, 2005 4:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Greg O'Bryant
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re: PDE engine video

Post by Greg O'Bryant » Tue Jul 12, 2005 3:07 am

It does look like the engine is a little small for the plane, but I don't know much about PDE's. On a side note, a few months ago on NPR, they were talking about a govermental plan to make hydrogen fueling possible at local gas stations to suport fuel cell cars. This may be good for pulse jets as well.:)

Bruno Ogorelec
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Re: re: PDE engine video

Post by Bruno Ogorelec » Tue Jul 12, 2005 10:12 am

Greg O'Bryant wrote:a few months ago on NPR, they were talking about a govermental plan to make hydrogen fueling possible at local gas stations to suport fuel cell cars. This may be good for pulse jets as well.:)
Zeppelins, too!

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