TP180-18 starting to take shape!!

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NickC
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re: TP180-18 starting to take shape!!

Post by NickC » Mon Dec 11, 2006 4:09 pm

for school? it was due today, but basically he said get it done asap because grading stuff is due to the school (end of semester is this week + 3 days)

Im going to take apart my cheaper weedwhacker and use the magneto, I should be able to put it back together. I'm going to have tell the neighbors to deal with the sound for a few minutes. im kinda in the "it has to get done" mode right now

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re: TP180-18 starting to take shape!!

Post by mk » Mon Dec 11, 2006 6:40 pm

Because you are in a hurry, you may want at least try to borrow (a) a compressor and/or, (b) a "hot air gun".

Both are likely to make your live wrt. starting easier.

Instead of spark plug ignition, you could either try (a) Eric's suggestion of heating up a single spot of the combustion chamber, or (b) something like those sparkling fireworks -- I am missing the word actually -- which burn slowly just giving a reasonably long amount of time to figure out starting conditions.
Well, it may even work (c) to light the flame outside the engine at the inlet port, when propane vapoure is supplied. Then you procede like "blowing the flame into the combustion chamber". Of course, this demands some practice, and may result in pretty difficult starting. While it also looks unprofessional and would be unfavourable in front of a crowed. Even though somwhat dangerous when there is some wind outside. But you could give it a try at home or so.
mk

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re: TP180-18 starting to take shape!!

Post by Eric » Mon Dec 11, 2006 7:05 pm

If you get a decent spark it wont take long at all to get it running.

If the new magneto makes a good spark, you might be able to open the spark gap up with a screwdriver a bit so there is more chance for ignition.

I havent ever tried a hair dryer for starting, though if you dont have a compressor it would certianly be worth a shot.

Lighting the tail can be a real pain in the ass compared to lighting the fuel mixture in the combustion chamber.

Try the new magneto, if you still have problems try the magneto + torch heating combustion chamber, if the torch is only the little propane style ones it might not get hot enough so you could try removing the spark plug and getting the engine warmed up, glowing nicely, then quick screw in the spark plug and heat the chamber with a torch since its already hot and crank it up to full throttle.

The piezo electric click igniters that come on harbor freight torches produce one hell of a spark, its a pain to click by hand but if you can find one and everything else isnt working, it might be worth a try.

Everything is always so much more difficult when your rushing, just try to keep from getting frustrated if somethings not working, cause often the solution is very simple but hard to see if your in a mad dash to get things done.

Do you have the paper part of the project mostly finished, so you can basically fill in the blanks later?

Eric
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re: TP180-18 starting to take shape!!

Post by NickC » Mon Dec 11, 2006 10:28 pm

IT RUNS!!!

I stuck a blowtorch in the pipe and with the propane on it ran! no forced air. I put a sparkplug in the hole and it was self sustaining. The only is when added the liquid fuel through te 8.5gph oilburner nozzle it died after i tried to add more fuel (rich extinct). Maybe it was in torch mode since I didn't add enough forced air?? I didn't know torch mode would self-suatin tho?

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re: TP180-18 starting to take shape!!

Post by NickC » Mon Dec 11, 2006 10:42 pm

hahaha!!! leafblower suprise!!! it was definitely in troch mode, the leafer blower borught it to life!

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re: TP180-18 starting to take shape!!

Post by NickC » Mon Dec 11, 2006 11:30 pm

i hate those gay "click" flow valves. It's very hard to get the engine running on liquid fuel. My neighbors were gettin mad or at least their braty kids were. A damn 8 year old yells,"Be quiet!" I ran it a few more times to scare them away lol and then my sister/fuel controller went inside and my mom is gonna be home soon (she doesn't want me to run it in the neighborhood). I think next time I will try getting it as deep into blowtorch mode as I can with the liquid fuel and propane and try starting it from there.

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re: TP180-18 starting to take shape!!

Post by Eric » Mon Dec 11, 2006 11:47 pm

You should have yelled back "SORRY I CANT HEAR YOU!"

When switching fuels get the engine running on propane, throttle it up to around max throttle to warm it up nice, and then throttle down to a low idle, and turn on the liquid fuel.

You dont want there to be so much propane that adding the liquid will cause it to have too much. Once you get the liquid fuel running, then you can turn down the propane more, turn the liquid up more, and then completely turn the propane off.

Once you get the hang of it things will be much easier, it just takes some getting used to.

Do you have a place that you can go to test the engine? Cant wait to see some pics and video of it in action :)

Eric
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re: TP180-18 starting to take shape!!

Post by NickC » Tue Dec 12, 2006 2:50 am

i don't think it will run on propane alone! the flow "click" valve shuts it off pretty bad. I'll find some place, I know this guy's house I might be able to go to.

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re: TP180-18 starting to take shape!!

Post by thecheat » Tue Dec 12, 2006 3:15 am

just a suggestion... you should be able to rig up something where you run it off of two tanks... shouldn't be hard to make, and would probably stop the problem.
Lasers, jets, and helicopters HURAH!

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re: TP180-18 starting to take shape!!

Post by NickC » Tue Dec 12, 2006 3:53 am

i thought about that, but i'm going to try to give it some extra fuel from the liquid side.

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re: TP180-18 starting to take shape!!

Post by Eric » Tue Dec 12, 2006 4:22 am

Oh the propane tank has one of those damn valves. I think we are going to have to start buying the propane tanks for forklifts. McMaster has them in various (large) sizes for $150, dont know if they can be filled at a regular fill station.

Can you get it running at all with the propane? The tank I got with a valve I took back because I couldnt even get my propane weed burner torch to work with it.

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Re: re: TP180-18 starting to take shape!!

Post by Dave_G » Tue Dec 12, 2006 5:17 am

Eric wrote:I think we are going to have to start buying the propane tanks for forklifts... dont know if they can be filled at a regular fill station.
That's all I use anymore, and yes, you can get them filled at any of the regular filling stations.

I don't recommend this to anyone, but before I had mine filled for the first time, I pulled the valve out, took it apart and removed the internal spring-loaded flow restrictor. This was a regular forklift tank valve.

I'm through with BBQ tanks...

The nice thing about the forklift tanks is they have separate liquid and vapor supply ports. I put a valve in each, and made a connector that tees both lines together, so I can start an engine on vapor, and then easily switch to liquid feed.

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re: TP180-18 starting to take shape!!

Post by NickC » Tue Dec 12, 2006 5:18 am

i can get it on torch mode with pretty much no adjustability with propane. then I add air and it goes into jet mode, but flames out. if i had a spark system i could keep it going until it was warm. I disassembled my weedwhacker, note disassembled not ripped apart :), and pull the whole top end so all I have is a crank, magneto, coil, and block (no cylinder). I'm pretty good with small engines so it should be easy to get back together after I'm down with it. I'm ordering a stun gun for an ignition system afterwards. $18 shipped!

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re: TP180-18 starting to take shape!!

Post by Dave_G » Tue Dec 12, 2006 5:40 am

re: the Stun gun...just so you know:

I've used them a couple of times to start pulsejets for convenience sake, but they have a couple of drawbacks:

[1] The spark rate is slow, about 2 per sec. Makes starting a little harder.

[2] If you fire them continuously for more than about five seconds at a time they burn out. I've ruined two. Maybe you can get a better one than I got.

BUT, they work great in the rain, when power cords would be a problem!

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re: TP180-18 starting to take shape!!

Post by NickC » Tue Dec 12, 2006 9:10 pm

I dont know what to do! maybe try the methanol? but I need gasoline to run eventually! I can get it to self sustain as a jet (not torch) with propane but then it dies! I tried to add gasoline to the mix and it starts throttling up and then it dies!! Could I make the engine more "durable" by adding more tailpipe??

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