Forum Chinese Contest
Moderator: Mike Everman
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re: Forum Chinese Contest
"s-shaped "throat" to maintain the total length limitation"
No no no, Bill; 33" max duct length (as if straightened out). No trombones or u-bends or convolutions to try for more duct length! No telescoping or Tesseracts. ;-)
No no no, Bill; 33" max duct length (as if straightened out). No trombones or u-bends or convolutions to try for more duct length! No telescoping or Tesseracts. ;-)
Mike Often wrong, never unsure.
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Re: re: Forum Chinese Contest
Got that.Mike Everman wrote:
No no no, Bill; 33" max duct length (as if straightened out).
I'll have to work on it. Looks like about 6 months, to make it happen.
BTW can we count on Messr. Eric B. for the next big meet?
You're currently the "mystery-man", to the rest of us "regulars"!!
Practice drinking beer and starting pulsejets before then--you'll need it.
Bill H.
Acoustic Propulsion Concepts
".......some day soon we'll be flying airplanes powered by pulsejets."
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re: Forum Chinese Contest
HehehePractice drinking beer and starting pulsejets before then--you'll need it.
Any time or place planned for the meet?
If it is in California I will definately go. I really want to move out there and that might be a good excuse to scout the place out. With any luck I might be living out there before the meet, which would be really nice because I am really really getting sick of this winter crap, at least NE PA winters with that damn fridgid Canadian down draft and lake efect snow.
Mike those rules are absolutely perfect!
Eric
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re: Forum Chinese Contest
To my mind, it's either at Ed's place in northern Arizona, or Mikhail's in Corvalis OR. I am leaning toward Ed's at the moment; shorter drive for me anyway. You can fly in here and ride with me, Eric, check out CA before or after.
Mike Often wrong, never unsure.
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Re: re: Forum Chinese Contest
I don't know - everything would be allowed, only length is the limit ?Mike Everman wrote:OK, how's this for rules:
1. 33" max duct length, favoring Chinese/Thermojet layout, disallowing u-bent linears
2. no limit on intakes
3. no limit on diameter
4. turbines and props ok, not considered part of the length
5. valveless only
6. single CC only
7. bent intakes ok
8. augmentors ok, not considered part of the length
TSFC, max static thrust and ??? categories
Official test at Flaming Farm next summer sometime?
There is no need to get too exited, since it would be about six months
before enything happens and lot of things may change including all
rules now proposed.
I would still favor some more categories with pretty defined rules and
limits, the same way as any racing and competitions go.
On the top of that should be one unlimited category.
Ed
P.S. How about "Roaring Farm" - we had Burning / Flaming Grapes
already.
...Nobody is right, nobody is wrong...
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re: Forum Chinese Contest
Sure we could have more categories, but really, we're talking about maybe 5 people doing this, and I can't even think of number 5.
I think making the "hot length" even on all is going to be most informative. Trying to match Eric for raw out of the box thinking is going to be a challenge!
I think making the "hot length" even on all is going to be most informative. Trying to match Eric for raw out of the box thinking is going to be a challenge!
Mike Often wrong, never unsure.
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Re: Forum Chinese Contest
Here's the v1.2 version of the project--it's in the lower photo; the upper is the first (unsuccessful) version, for comparision.hinote wrote: I attempted to start my M10E "Quadir" chinese pulsejet today.
The result is a failure--but it was certainly an interesting one, for me. It was obvious the proportions were incorrect.
Both Eric B. and Mike E. have commented on this thread that the proportions of this engine were "unconventional".
In the case of the current effort, I'll be going back and trying to establish proportions more in-line with the "classic" Chinese. I hope I can save the project, as an easy to build example.
I was going to try and run it today--but "life got in the way", as usual. I anticipate a first effort tomorrow--and I'll post the results.
Stay tuned.
Bill H.
Acoustic Propulsion Concepts
".......some day soon we'll be flying airplanes powered by pulsejets."
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- M10E v1.1 and v1.2.JPG (62.13 KiB) Viewed 10214 times
re: Forum Chinese Contest
Rules, rules
Its thrust for fuel thats important, not thrust for size.
just go for max specific thrust,
provided you can carry the engine to the comp. meet location ;-)
And remove the chinese limit. Any new valveless (i.e. not lockwood etc)
Then we'll just be back to the old "forum" rules.
Its thrust for fuel thats important, not thrust for size.
just go for max specific thrust,
provided you can carry the engine to the comp. meet location ;-)
And remove the chinese limit. Any new valveless (i.e. not lockwood etc)
Then we'll just be back to the old "forum" rules.
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re: Forum Chinese Contest
Point taken, Don. It wasn't the intent to limit it to chinese style only.
To make it fair to linear motors, the 33 inch limit would apply to the length from tail exit to CC head (that is, where the intake tube meets the CC or meets the CC cone). Recouperators also not considered part of the length.
Several of us applying ourselves to a single hot length will really tell us some things. Really. We could use some focus, and true apples to apples testing with at least one metric made equal.
I'm going to start as soon as I play with my AS-1 some more.
To make it fair to linear motors, the 33 inch limit would apply to the length from tail exit to CC head (that is, where the intake tube meets the CC or meets the CC cone). Recouperators also not considered part of the length.
Several of us applying ourselves to a single hot length will really tell us some things. Really. We could use some focus, and true apples to apples testing with at least one metric made equal.
I'm going to start as soon as I play with my AS-1 some more.
Mike Often wrong, never unsure.
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re: Forum Chinese Contest
Indeed. Out of the box thinking is good, but sometimes you have to think outside of whatever the hell the box is inside of.I think making the "hot length" even on all is going to be most informative. Trying to match Eric for raw out of the box thinking is going to be a challenge!
Bill that looks much better, hopefull it runs a lot better for you too. Did you flare the intake more? I really think that is a big thing to do, but you could always just do that after the next run.
Eric
Re: re: Forum Chinese Contest
And on a related note, it's also the thrust to weight ratio, the streamlineness, the weight of the fuel tank, the cost of the fuel, the construction technique and actual cost to make it, and my personal favorite, I kind of like cubic centimeters, like my midsize SUV that runs on 3 cylinders yet accelerates adequately doing zero to sixty in ~7.2 seconds. It's like having half an engine half of the time. When have you ever seen mileage claimed is actual mileage? I just took a trip to Texas and when they say 24 mpg highway I'd swear they are being modest. I guess jet engines can do the same thing though, the afterburner philosophy.serverlan wrote:Rules, rules
Its thrust for fuel thats important, not thrust for size.
just go for max specific thrust,
provided you can carry the engine to the comp. meet location ;-)
And remove the chinese limit. Any new valveless (i.e. not lockwood etc)
Then we'll just be back to the old "forum" rules.
Mark
http://autos.yahoo.com/newcars/honda_pi ... imid=18515
Trim: EX 2WD 5-Spd AT
HONDA HIT THE MARK
by Thomas Nielsen from Tucson, AZ (11/17/05)
"This car is the most silent, refined and yet powerfull SUV I have ever driven. On my first tank of gas I got 21.5 MPG - never even had it on the highway. I picked the 2wdr for fuel economy + living in the desert part in Arizona snow is very rare, at 8 inch ground clearence it will still take me on ..."
Last edited by Mark on Tue Nov 29, 2005 12:44 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Forum Chinese Contest
Please see the attached photo.hinote wrote: I attempted to start my M10E "Quadir" chinese pulsejet today.
Here's the v1.2 version of the project.
It shows the fueling arrangement for my test attempt today--to start M10E v1.2.
This effort was unsuccessful--but I think I got pretty close.
The fuel stinger is a length of 1/4-inch brake line tubing with the end pinched closed; 2 holes are drilled into the side of the stinger near the end, with a #58 drill (that's small!). The stinger is clamped to the throat tube with 2 hose clamps.
I got a very strong howling mode, and a low-level resonance in the intake tube. I wasn't able to bring it up to full resonance, but I have the feeling that the stinger depth needs adjustng, to find the "sweet-spot".
I'll take the whole thing as-is, to Mike's on Saturday. 2 (or more!) PJ enthusiasts are going to be necessary to get this cantankerous beasty up and running!
Bill H.
Acoustic Propulsion Concepts
".......some day soon we'll be flying airplanes powered by pulsejets."
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re: Forum Chinese Contest
I'd try a 3/32 copper feed tube, cut straight. Looking good, though!
Mike Often wrong, never unsure.
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Re: re: Forum Chinese Contest
Hi Mike,Mike Everman wrote:I'd try a 3/32 copper feed tube, cut straight. Looking good, though!
Where do you find that stuff? I am having a hard time finding even the 1/8 hollow copper tubing.
I would like to come. Have to convince my better half.
Can you send me the time, address ect... ?
Thanks!
HT
Hagen Tannberg
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re: Forum Chinese Contest
Noon till dark, Saturday, 82 Aero Camino, Goleta 93117
Any hobby store and some hardware stores, like mine down the street will have a display with all sizes under 3/8 in aluminum, copper and brass.
Any hobby store and some hardware stores, like mine down the street will have a display with all sizes under 3/8 in aluminum, copper and brass.
Mike Often wrong, never unsure.
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