Re: Pressure Gain Combustion (Now Proven)
Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 8:17 pm
Yes, I am going to Magnetewan River near Parry Sound, Ontario.
"Home-made Jet Forum"
http://www.pulse-jets.com/phpbb3/
Okey,Mike Everman wrote:Yes, I am going to Magnetewan River near Parry Sound, Ontario.
Greetings guys,luc wrote:Greetings guys,
Hear this ... he he he ...
Did another test today using a smaller turbo for our small engine and guess what ....
Above 95,000 rpm ...
And this ... Not even being at full power. At engine Idle power, the turbo turns apprx. 50,000 rmp and I reached above 95,000 only at 50% engine power.
Tomorow I will do other tests to records temp., noise, rpm readings and will push that turbo to engine maximum power ... he he he ... Hope the turbo won't blow-up for it is rated to a max. of 115,000 rpm. Our tubo expert guy who's working with us on this, believe that with our engine, this turbo will break a speed reccord for its kind and model.
Anyway, will bring you a nice movie of this tomorow ...
He he he ... Yessssssssss ... 95,000 rpm .......
Regards,
Heyy Jonny,Jonny69 wrote:Good effort Luc. Just a crappy picture but here's the one I built for my degree:
I didn't get a chance to measure any rpm's but it ran pretty fast and glowed up like yours!
I'll buy you a beer, we can toast to everyone who says it can't be done!
I thought it stopped spinning awfully fast in the video!luc wrote: Even if at first glance, I published the impressive 95,000 rpm above, the real figure now points out more towards 15,000 rpm and even if at this point, we are not all conviced about that too
Hi Mike,Mike Everman wrote:I thought it stopped spinning awfully fast in the video!luc wrote: Even if at first glance, I published the impressive 95,000 rpm above, the real figure now points out more towards 15,000 rpm and even if at this point, we are not all conviced about that too
Hi John,racketmotorman wrote:My turboprop PJ experiments failed even though I was able to get my ~6" dia homemade axial turbine to ~20,000 rpm ( tach recorded) , this was with no load and it did take a long time to spooldown once the engine was shut off , though with loading ( prop) it was pathetic .
Theres pics of my turbopro PJ here ,....... http://www.racketmotorman.turbinebuilder.com/
http://www.racketmotorman.turbinebuilde ... hp?album=5
Also a video of it running somewhere on the site
I know ... This is why our two setups are going to this "Turbo Specialist" where they will match turbine and compressor wheels and housings trying to get the best match for best rpms and torque.but trying to judge the exact sizing for your particular situation will most likely be a trial and error exercise
Roger that ... But don't forget we are not at the stage of hadding a prop yet, but mostly to the stage of turbo generation only. Gearbox and props will come later and only after we have answered actual GLC's commercial needs.Please don't exceed a turbine inlet temp of more than 900 deg C if extending the rpm , and try keeping rpm to a level where tip speeds are below ~1,500 ft/sec , which from the vid of your engine appears to have a reasonably large turbine , so probably ~60,000 rpm for safety sake , unless you don't mid tips flying off
Thanks ...All the best with the experiments
You are more then welcome to do so ...I'll be keeping an eye on your progress
Stangely ... I see success where you see failure in your project. But again, it all depends from where you look. Personnaly, I just think you are going somewhere, but as a piece of advice ... Keep the steps simple and small and do them one at the time.to see if you can succeed where I failed )
My advice here ... Never compare apples with orange ... Especialy when trying to evaluate achievements. There are simply no comparisons between turbines and PJs ... BUT, even if PJs seems to be no match against turbine, they will provide numérous advantages (i.e : Simplycity, low cost, low maintnance ... ect ect ect) compared to turbines. It all depends what you want to do with it and falls down to "Applications".LOL..... I guess I felt I failed because I couldn't get usable power out of the engine , despite the huge amount of noise it made along with its appetite for fuel ,compared to my turbine engines there wasn't any power coming out the tailpipe
They use both. Turbines will often provide higher mass and lower speed where PJs will provide lower mass and higher speed when talking about exhaust gases and or thrust. Again ... Two different story here and again, it all depends what you are looking for (i.e : Application again).I have a suspicion that PJs develop their thrust more from "pressure thrust" further inside the engine, rather than the "usual" mass flow times velocity at the exhaust like a turbine engine does
True ... But again, maybe this is sufficient for the need being. One note taugh ... At one point when testing, we realised that when loading the compressor with a restriction on, the actual turbo rpm increased by more then 20% ... . Which lead to conclude in two possibilities, 1) being that pressure was also increased in the turbine wheel, thus, higher rpm too 2) being that fuel combustion was not all completed at the engine, so loading the compressor actually favored residual combustion "Inside" the turbine housing. We are still investigating this one.Without any significat pressure ratio being available for accelerating gases across the freepower turbine, one needs to utilise the available velocity exiting the tailpipe as the power producer
Possible and maybe true for your actual setup. Keep in mind that when playing with PJs (i.e : Thermo Acoustic engine or burner), the word "Acoustic" take all its place and must always be seriously considered since these devices are highly sensitive to thier immidiate suroundings. This means, that one must always make sure that all is sychronized and well tunned ... Otherwise, you might loose all your power right there.An interesting thing that did happen with my engine was the freepowers rpm increased by ~10% when the "gap" between the tailpipe and freepower inlet was closed off by a sliding sleeve , making the engine "breath" back thru the freepower , rather than thru the "gap"
The freepower was designed to have cold ambiant air "follow" the hot pulse thru the freepower , in an augmenting fashion , but it didn't appear to happen all that successfully
Sorry to say this and you know me being a "Direct" guy ... But maybe this is why you keep having that "Failure" feeling for you always keep comparing apple with oranges ... Stop doing that and forget about turbines if you what to venture and play with PJs ... These are two different story here.Turbines by their very nature require gases to be accelerated by a pressure reduction , unfortunately theres no significant static pressure issuing from the PJ exhaust that can be expanded and accelerated
I am not and that's the most important for now. My goal here is to combine two different expertise here and without spoiling my mind with that "Turbine stuff". Don't forget that once, I use to be a jet engine technician for other companies and it is really hard for me too to seperate both concept. So this is why, this guy remains in his field of expertise and I stay in mine, keeping both minds clear ... He tells what he needs to have his turbo spinning and I tell him what I need for my engine to work......this is why I'm a little sceptical of any turbo/turbine expert being able to give hard advice on what configuration of comp/turb for you to use successfully
Not there yet ... Right now, we are aiming at two things first and in order , 1) is to have a combination that will first allow the engine to operate well, 2) achieving maximum rpm with maximum velocity. Then, we will start addressing "Pressure". I told you John ... One step at the time.What sort of static pressure do you have entering the turbine ?? ......you'll have a fluctuating total pressure from the dynamic components of the pulses , but the mean static pressure is what'll be needed
Again ... I am not there yet ... But as an hindsight, it already works without one or better said, a very small one.Also with your fitting a comp/turb combo to your engine , you'll need a faily large plenum between comp and engine to smooth out the different airflow requirements between comp outflow and engine inflow , on turbocharged single cylinder IC engines the plenum needs to be several times the swept volume of the engine , otherwise the outflow of the comp is compromised from the intermittent demand of the engine
Good ... And a good advice here, would be for you to write down what I call a "Scope of Work" with all the steps you feel you should have, and then, have this scope review by someone who is not involved in the project so this guy "Unsecurity" (Especially if he signs the checks) will cut your scope into many more steps to make sure you won't miss one and/or ram forward to later have to come back.Your advice of "one step at a time" is very sound advice , I try to adhere to it , along with keeping good records of adjustments/additions/modifications/testruns etc etc . , nothing worse that not knowing which change made which result )
Look for the patent ... It is now public and I believe a guy here posted on it ...Is there another earlier Thread on your engine , where theres more detail on what/how the engine/gas producer is constructed ?? ......as I'm not fully aware of all your running conditions and would like to be
Ouppsss ... This is where you're TOTALY lost and talking trough your hat John. But that's okey since we did'nt have time to chat alot before.Myself also being a direct guy, can only say that ,from the comments you've made so far you know very little about turbine engines , either 1 or 2 shafters )
No Shit ... He he he But who the hell told you that "I don't know whats going in to it"???? ... Heyyy, I designed this damn engine ... So, I sure know what,s coming out of his ass ... Don't you think????Irrespective of the gas producer used, PJ or gas turbine, the turbine producing shaft horsepower requires certain conditions to produce power, if you don't know whats going in to it, how are you going to design it ??
Same here, but except I don't have to run after Data as far as our PulseRam is concern ...The freepower turbine on my turbo prop PJ was designed using the best available data I could find on Site here and on the net with regards the efflux conditions of pulse jets
Indeed ... But one point I need to point out here, is that you are playing with an "Axial" setup where I am playing with an "Impellor" ... Don't forget this ... Two different ball game here.With my freepowered turbine machines, the gas producer was developed to produce its maximum thrust as a pure jet, running data was then collected, and that data then used to design the turbine stage to produce the shaft power ..........one step at a time , as you most correctly noted
Like I said above ... Did I ever mentionned somewhere that I or we don't know these basic data?If you don't have even basic data from your base engine, such as the static pressure I mentioned, you, or rather, your turbine expert, will be flying blind when it comes to designing the turbine stage
Well ... Only one comment here, for "Failing" is not an option and for I have peoples behind me writting down the checks and I certainly don't want a bunch of shareholders angry ... He he he ...As I said in my first email ,....." I'll be keeping an eye on your progress to see if you can succeed where I failed"