Pressure Gain Combustion (Now Proven)

Jets that defy normal classification

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ace_fedde
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Re: Pressure Gain Combustion (Now Proven)

Post by ace_fedde » Mon Nov 23, 2009 10:33 pm

I've also been thinking about using a pressure-jet injector system in front of the inlet of a valveless PJ. In fact Eric has already been doing something like that but inside the inlet and without the heating of the fuel:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=5229&st=0&sk=t&sd=a ... 345#p64671

What will happen then is that the PJ can breathe in through the inlets but cannot (or hardly) breathe out through the inlets, which will increase the combustion pressure. Thus higher thermal efficiency.
Of course it also allows the PJ to have some kind of resistance at the exhaust, as long as that "resistance" (for example a turbine) doesn't desturb the accoustics.

It seems however that a pressure jet injection system isn't using all the available energy (I don't mean the chemical energy)in the fuel stream, but can be upgraded :?: with some kind of device :?: making the injection system's ejectors much more efficient :!:

Which device? Don't say yet :twisted: Has H and S in it. O.k. the quiz has started 8)

Fedde
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luc
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Re: Pressure Gain Combustion (Now Proven)

Post by luc » Tue Nov 24, 2009 2:32 pm

Hi Ace,
ace_fedde wrote:I've also been thinking about using a pressure-jet injector system in front of the inlet of a valveless PJ. In fact Eric has already been doing something like that but inside the inlet and without the heating of the fuel:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=5229&st=0&sk=t&sd=a ... 345#p64671

What will happen then is that the PJ can breathe in through the inlets but cannot (or hardly) breathe out through the inlets, which will increase the combustion pressure. Thus higher thermal efficiency.
Of course it also allows the PJ to have some kind of resistance at the exhaust, as long as that "resistance" (for example a turbine) doesn't desturb the accoustics.

It seems however that a pressure jet injection system isn't using all the available energy (I don't mean the chemical energy)in the fuel stream, but can be upgraded :?: with some kind of device :?: making the injection system's ejectors much more efficient :!:

Which device? Don't say yet :twisted: Has H and S in it. O.k. the quiz has started 8)

Fedde
But again, you simply limit your self talking about a pressure jet intake system with a PJ ...

My above message was more toward maybe using a combination of pressure jet, PJ and other possible engines OR concepts to obtain the "Goal", which if you read the title, talks about "Pressure Gain Combustion" and more specifically ... Building a gas turbine with all these components or concepts.

If you remember, the goal here is to have a gas turbine that will start on its own, with no starters.

This said, I have done some other work toward that direction with interesting results using a combination of concepts and for once, not concentrating on "Thermodynamics", but a bit more on "Fluid dynamics" and "Hydraulics".

If only I could have more free time and not being so focused on GLC's short terms goals ... But it will come.

Overall, my above message was simply to lead peoples on "Maybe we are not looking at the right place" ... Or instruct the known experts here on the fact that their "Expertise" can sometime become their own "Race horse blinds"... In fact, my message was more about "Open your horizon" and don't simply look infront of your nose.

Anyway, I will publish more once I am done with it ...

Best regards,
Luc
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ace_fedde
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Re: Velocity Gain Combustion

Post by ace_fedde » Wed Nov 25, 2009 6:16 pm

Luc,
luc wrote: My above message was more toward ....to obtain the "Goal", which if you read the title, talks about "Pressure Gain Combustion" and more specifically ... Building a gas turbine with all these components or concepts.
I hope you know that it has already been done:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=5377&start=75#p66393
I first thought I had a new idea...
I would like to state though that the rapported setup is not a very efficient one. It needs to get rid of reed valves, needs to get rid of using the inlet's exhaust stream again for the breathing of the exhaust, and needs to use more the momentum of the gasses instead of just expansion (it needs more "impuls-turbining"). A pulse combuster is not only a Pressure-gain Combustor, it's also a Velocity-gain Combustor (VGC :D )!
luc wrote: If you remember, the goal here is to have a gas turbine that will start on its own, with no starters.
When using a self-starting pulse combustor and using the momentum (not pressure) of the gasses for the first stage of the turbine this should be possible.

Note for other readers: In a conventional GT it is not possible to self-start because, other than the PJ, it needs pressure(loss) and forced flow to establish combustion. This can only be achieved with spooling up the GT before igniting. The GT's combustion is from itself directionless and without flow it would force exhaustgasses through the compressor before it dies out.
The PJ's combustion give's direction (and speed) to the gasses so that they are forced through the turbine only.

Also we could see the PJ itself as a compressor-stage what means that it could feed a (impuls)turbine without a compressor, as long as the pressure build up in the turbine's inlet doesn't get higher than the maximum achievable pressure gain.
luc wrote: This said, I have done some other work toward that direction with interesting results using a combination of concepts and for once, not concentrating on "Thermodynamics", but a bit more on "Fluid dynamics" and "Hydraulics".

If only I could have more free time and not being so focused on GLC's short terms goals ... But it will come.

Anyway, I will publish more once I am done with it ...
Can't wait to see how you did it. So curious!! :D

Fedde
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Re: Pressure Gain Combustion (Now Proven)

Post by Viv » Wed Nov 25, 2009 6:52 pm

Ah Fedde! don't go spoiling my little joke now with too much information :wink: its a few years old now but still going strong by the looks of it :D

Viv
"Sometimes the lies you tell are less frightening than the loneliness you might feel if you stopped telling them" Brock Clarke

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Monsieur le commentaire

luc
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Re: Velocity Gain Combustion

Post by luc » Wed Nov 25, 2009 7:56 pm

ace_fedde wrote:Can't wait to see how you did it. So curious!! :D
Well ... Be patient ... It will come ...

If I ever get over the work load I have here ... But it will come ...

Cya,
Luc
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luc
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Re: Pressure Gain Combustion (Now Proven)

Post by luc » Mon Aug 15, 2011 6:37 pm

Irvine.J wrote:....Kittens...with spikes coming out of them......

Sorry just had to upload this pic somewhere for my little tag down the bottom... this is as good a place as any...Go Caboose!
Hi Irvine,

Reading old post, just came accross these pictures and found them and the hazard funy as I'm one dedicated Halo gamer since a while now ... :wink:

Have you tried and played "Reach"?

Good day,
Luc
Designer & Inventor

Viv
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Re: Pressure Gain Combustion (Now Proven)

Post by Viv » Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:36 pm

Viv wrote:Ah Fedde! don't go spoiling my little joke now with too much information :wink: its a few years old now but still going strong by the looks of it :D

Viv
And still going, as a practical joke this has far exceeded my expectations ;-)

I will have to write up the story of how it happened when I get time,

""Update"" I have started writing that as in hindsight it is pretty funny, I will post it as soon as I have it finished up ;-)

Viv
"Sometimes the lies you tell are less frightening than the loneliness you might feel if you stopped telling them" Brock Clarke

Viv's blog

Monsieur le commentaire

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