Bagotville AFB Airshow (Canada)

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luc
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Bagotville AFB Airshow (Canada)

Post by luc » Fri Jul 01, 2005 8:28 pm

Greetings,

Okey ... Here is an update on the Bagotville Airshow.

I just came back from the Bagotville AFB. I will tell you one thing, this will be an Airshow. There will F-18 Fighter, KC-135 Tanker, CL-415 Water bomber, many many other planes, ground exhibits of all types,

And .... One Pulse jet ... Hé hé hé. Actually ... From what I can remember, I think it as been a hell of a while since a Gluhareff Pressure jet as been present in a Air show.

But this is over now. Conception GLC is going there with its GLC Modified 20 Lbs. pressure jet ... And we will be RUNNING and running loud. This one is for you Eugene ... Where ever you may be.

Bye the way ... For all of you Canadian and Quebecois that will dare travel the distance, let it be known that an CF-18 Hornet will be waiting there for you to sit your ass in it. Yeap ... The Bagotville AFB has setup an F-18 in a hangar for peoples to sit in it and see what it feels like to look at the HUD... Hé hé hé ... And this is no joke.

And guess how is here with us? ... Good old Dave. Yeap, the Dave we all know. And he get to sit in this F-18. I wounder if he fits in? Welll ... Maybe Viv and I will have to push him in, but will sit in it. And for taking him out ... Welll, we will just pull the ejection seat strap ...

Hoo shit ... We forgot, the jet is in a hangar ... Sorry Dave ....

Here is the link : http://www.saib2005.com/

See you all there ...

Luc

Dave
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re: Bagotville AFB Airshow (Canada)

Post by Dave » Tue Jul 05, 2005 2:37 am

So what happens when you go to the first air show in Bagotville, Quebec, Canada since 9/11? ( http://www.saib2005.com ) First you get to see some really amazing airplanes and flying. Then you hear a Pulse / Pressure Jet engine fire up and watch the crowd stop looking at the planes and start looking at the engine. It is amazing at how many people flock to something that loud and that unusual. After the run they would all stick around to ask questions, especially the air force guys.

Luc and Viv were good enough to let me hang out with them for a few days. I got to play in their new shop, live with their families, learn some French, go the air show, run their engine and put my A$$ in a real life F18 (yes it actually did fit). For me it was a 1546 mile round trip by car, but well worth it. If those Canadian Air Force guys had just let me take the F18 home, the trip back would have been a lot faster!

Check out the attached pictures.

Dave
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Now it is my turn to run the engine
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Everyone has a question.
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Everyone sticks around after the run
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The crowd starts to gather
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Everyone turns to look when the noise starts.
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Start and warm up.
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Setup and the test before the public comes through the gate.
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The Snow Birds do their thing!
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In the F18
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luc
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re: Bagotville AFB Airshow (Canada)

Post by luc » Tue Jul 05, 2005 2:15 pm

Great pictures Dave,

We sure hope you enjoyed your stay around us and the Air Show Buddy.

As for fitting in the F-18 and especially fitting OUT, was good for you, because I was getting ready to pull that ejection seat handle ... He he he.
I like you alot Dave ... But I sure would have loved to see you fly OFF this F-18 under 10 to 12 G acceleration ... Man I would have love this ... He he he. It's a bird .... It's a plane .... Nooooo, it's supersonic Dave.

Overall, this weekend and your presence here was a great success. Hopefully, we hope we have encourage peoples to come out of there garage and start building engines that won't end-up in a pile of scrap.

Progress come out of inovations, inovations come out of research and research can only be done by humans like all of us.

This last weekend clearly demonstrated that after all these years, pulse jets and pressure jets are still mis-known and mis-understood, but becomes very popular and generate major interest when peoples get to see them, hear them and understand them.

Thanks for the pictures Davyboy, as you know, you're always welcome to our place.

Regards,

Luc

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re: Bagotville AFB Airshow (Canada)

Post by Bruno Ogorelec » Tue Jul 05, 2005 4:47 pm

Great pictures, Dave! Thank you. Luc, Viv, congratulations. It looks like you have put up a professional-looking show.

Too bad you could not have come to the Burning Grape. You'd have added a lot to the proceedings.

Was there any interest at the show for the Chinese?

Did people ask about practical applications of the pressure jet?

What did you tell them?

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Re: re: Bagotville AFB Airshow (Canada)

Post by Viv » Tue Jul 05, 2005 6:10 pm

[quote="Bruno Ogorelec"]Great pictures, Dave! Thank you. Luc, Viv, congratulations. It looks like you have put up a professional-looking show.

Too bad you could not have come to the Burning Grape. You'd have added a lot to the proceedings.

Was there any interest at the show for the Chinese?

Did people ask about practical applications of the pressure jet?

What did you tell them?[/quote]

Yes Dave took some nice pictures, the show was a success for us but Dave will be the first to say it took a lot of work to make it look profesional, he will say! as soon as he arrived here we put him to work in the shop helping paint the thrust stand and then polish the demo Chinese to a high gloss:-) we gave him a chinese kit to take home as thanks:-)

Luc gave me three days to get the DAS software written that I had allocated a month of development time to:-(

As we explained to Dave we would have loved to come to the convention but it was before we posted our patent so we would have spent the whole event biting our toungs and not being able to say anything, having seen our progress and developments Dave fully understood why we could not go.

Yes lots of interest in the chinese and all things pulse jet, some all ready knew about them the majority did not but now they do:-)

People were very pleased to see a local company developing a new technology in Canada and very impressed by the demonstrations, we told them about heating applications and possible uses in drones, the air force guys were pretty interested in that side of things.

People pretty much asked all the questions you could think of including how the hell does it work with no moving parts:-) a thousand or so business cards were taken and our web site hit rate has gone silly!

So yes a good show for us and the people of our region Lac-saint-jean.

Only problem we had was on Sunday as when we demonstrated no one anywere on the base could hear the tannoy system so in the afternoon we watched he snowbirds and CF16 and CF18 pilots strut there stuff.

You have to laugh when an F18 pilot says your making to much noise:-)

Viv

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re: Bagotville AFB Airshow (Canada)

Post by Viv » Tue Jul 05, 2005 6:17 pm

I forgot to say a BD5 was parked behind our stand, (see the pic) do you remember the one with two 130Rs mounted on it? they were built to the original Gluhareff plans so did not deliver more than 60 Lbs each, now we have the 130R working at 145 Lbs that would be fun to try again:-)

Know anybody with a BD5?:-)

Viv

Mark
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re: Bagotville AFB Airshow (Canada)

Post by Mark » Wed Jul 06, 2005 12:17 am

Looks like a lot of fun. I think you should have done a few jam jars too though. LOL
You never know, they might have liked the simplicity.
Good job there.
Mark
Presentation is Everything

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re: Bagotville AFB Airshow (Canada)

Post by Dave » Wed Jul 06, 2005 11:48 am

Bruno: There appeared to be questions about everything. Unfortunately, I had a hard time following most of the conversations as the majority were in French. Although my French vocabulary is 500% better than it was the last time I visited Luc and Viv (now approaching 20+ words on a good day), most of what I got was from hand movements and pointing. The military guys were the easiest for me to talk with, especially the ones in Radar, Communications and aircraft support. This is probably because of their being involved in NATO. As I may have mentioned earlier, one of the organizers told me that this is their first air show at Bagotville since 9/11. Apparently most of their resources have gone into increased North American security since that date.

Mark: Point well taken about the Jam Jars. They do provide a simple way to demonstrate the basic principle behind pulse jets.

What I can also tell you is that there is little that is simple about what Luc and Viv have been doing for the past year. They don’t have other jobs like the rest of us do. They have devoted themselves full time to researching and developing Pulse and Pressure Jet engines. Their shop is now very well equipped, they put it to good use and they work long days in the pursuit of their goals. They were also very free with information now that they have filed their patents. There are still more areas R&D being persued and I think they would had to shoot me if they told me any more.

Even though I expected the noise made by the engine to attract attention at the air show, I was still surprised by the positive response it got. Every time it was started, heads would turn, feet would start moving in the direction of the noise and fingers would go into unprotected ears. After every run a crowd would stick around to hear more about the engine and to ask questions. Military, RC modelers, gear heads, people in other industries where heat is involved and just plane folks took a deep interest in the engine and the technology behind it.

Gotta run. Am still trying to figure out how to convert the .MOV files produced by my camera to a Windows Format most people can view here. Will try to post more pictures, and hopefully a video clip later.

Dave

luc
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Re: re: Bagotville AFB Airshow (Canada)

Post by luc » Wed Jul 06, 2005 2:24 pm

Hi Mark,
Mark wrote:Looks like a lot of fun. I think you should have done a few jam jars too though. LOL
You never know, they might have liked the simplicity.
Good job there.
Mark
Welll ... From what we know now, it seem peoples from both areas such as commercial and recreationnal, have a tendency to speperate them self from each other. Especially the comercial peoples.

So, what I am basically saying here, is to some level and to the commercial peoples, Jam Jars, Chinese and regular pulse jet are persieved like toy toy and as the potential to greatly discredite the seriousness of one company.

On many occasion, with our Chinese on the table, I had peoples saying "That's a pulse jet ... That's just a toy" and I had to come back saying that this engine was there for the only purpose to have peoples see how simple it is and weight evaluation.

Strangely, we found out there is alot of peoples that know about valved and valveless pulse jets and it seems there is a general concencious about these engines being only recreational engines with inherent weakness.

On the other hand what we also found out is that the pressure jet and its advantages was a big surprise and revelation to them, where their knowledge was close to none.

So, being a company aiming for commercial and military markets, we have to be carefull what we bring on the table and demonstrate, otherwise, we might destroy our credentials.

This last weekend was a clear indication toward what direction we should persue and where we should be carefull steping in. This also aplys to what engines we bring with us and demonstrate.

Hope this clarify why the Chinese was the only pulse jet on the table and probably the last time it will be demonstrated by Conception GLC.

Regards,

Luc

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re: Bagotville AFB Airshow (Canada)

Post by skyfrog » Wed Jul 06, 2005 3:37 pm

Hi Viv,

Can i have a question please.

Do Canada's regulation allow modified glider, I mean jet powered, and hence self-launched glider ?

Any helps will be much appreciated.
Long live jet engine !
Horace
Jetbeetle

luc
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Re: re: Bagotville AFB Airshow (Canada)

Post by luc » Wed Jul 06, 2005 3:45 pm

Hi Skyfrog,
skyfrog wrote:Hi Viv,

Can i have a question please.

Do Canada's regulation allow modified glider, I mean jet powered, and hence self-launched glider ?

Any helps will be much appreciated.
Allow me to answer this one, being an ex-pilot my self and a Canadian.

If your glider, using any engine type you can think of, is human piloted, you then have to comply with MOTC (Ministery Of Transportation of Canada) rules and regulations, meaning having a licence, comply with safety regulation and certifications.

Hope this answer your question.

Cya,

Luc

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Re: re: Bagotville AFB Airshow (Canada)

Post by Bruno Ogorelec » Wed Jul 06, 2005 9:17 pm

Luc wrote: Jam Jars, Chinese and regular pulse jet are persieved like toy toy and as the potential to greatly discredite the seriousness of one company.

On many occasion, with our Chinese on the table, I had peoples saying "That's a pulse jet ... That's just a toy" and I had to come back saying that this engine was there for the only purpose to have peoples see how simple it is and weight evaluation.

Strangely, we found out there is alot of peoples that know about valved and valveless pulse jets and it seems there is a general concencious about these engines being only recreational engines with inherent weakness.
Yes, Luc, that is my experience also. In fact, the more somebody knows about pulsejets, the more he is likely to dismiss them out of hand and lose any interest whatsoever right away.

I've talked to a number of people in jet engine and gas turbine engineering and the moment you mention pulsejets their eyes glaze over and they start trying to change the subject.

You were right not to have anything there to encourage such thinking. Even the Chinese was borderline.

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Re: re: Bagotville AFB Airshow (Canada)

Post by luc » Wed Jul 06, 2005 9:34 pm

Hi Bruno,
Bruno Ogorelec wrote: You were right not to have anything there to encourage such thinking. Even the Chinese was borderline.
Yeap Bruno. Indeed, the Chinese engine was borderline.

Now that you mention this, when Dave came to our place and showed us the video on the California meeting, I was trilled to see all these brainniacs and genius together. I wish we could have gone there.

But on the other hand, when I saw that pile of pulse jets in a garbage can, I could'nt stop my self being sad and thinking ... "What a waist of time, material and Brain juice".

I think of most of you guys to be damn genius about the subject. But I can't stop my self asking ... Are'nt we chewing over and over and over that same chewing gum here?

Anyway, the answer for Viv and I is quit clear on that subject and this is why we have decided to explore other areas. Not that I don't respect your work ... I just beleive that you guys have the full potential to go much more further and push fronteers.

But I don't think you will achieve that with common pulse jets, especially the ones using valves.

Anyway, that's my personal opinion and with all due respect.

Regards,

Luc

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Re: re: Bagotville AFB Airshow (Canada)

Post by Bruno Ogorelec » Wed Jul 06, 2005 10:18 pm

Luc wrote:when I saw that pile of pulse jets in a garbage can, I could'nt stop my self being sad and thinking ... "What a waist of time, material and Brain juice". (...) Anyway, the answer for Viv and I is quit clear on that subject and this is why we have decided to explore other areas. Not that I don't respect your work ... I just beleive that you guys have the full potential to go much more further and push fronteers. But I don't think you will achieve that with common pulse jets, especially the ones using valves.
Luc, you are right in most of what you say – except the garbage can. We were working in a vineyard. The can was a very good dry place to hold the engines in. Far better than having them lie in the grass.

But yes, you are right about the scope of our efforts. There is absolutely no doubt that you two can go so much further, simply because you are going at it full time with serious resources at your disposal.

Sadly, few if any other people in the forum can do that. (Which is good for you, or the market would soon be very crowded.) 99 percent of the enthusiasts can only devote a few hours and a few dollars a week to this pursuit. You are the only ones to be trying to make it a proper business.

The result is a lot of fun, but not much progress. Yet, it should not be dismissed lightly. Even such a haphazard approach has cumulated results and in six years or so that the forum has been active, the knowledge base has grown impressively.

I also agree with you that the probability of major progress with “common pulse jetsâ€

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re: Bagotville AFB Airshow (Canada)

Post by mk » Wed Jul 06, 2005 11:26 pm

Wow! Great pictures!

I'd just love to see and hear the 130R -- do you call it this way, too? -- engine running.

Hope you two'll have the chance to attend another meet.
Hopefully me, too, then.
mk

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